white smoke & the air escaping from coolant tank every 10 secs :o( blown head gasket ? (17DR L-plate

  • Thread starter Thread starter dvg
  • Start date Start date
D

dvg

Hello group.
2 days ago I've noticed a white smoke coming out from the exhaust pipe.
Today I've checked coolant and it was way below the normal level. Filled it
up to the mark and started the engine. Noticed that the coolant's cap
discharges some air at regular intervals (approx 10 secs). Engine oil looks
as usual (not creamy). Temperature gauge doesnt exceed 90 deg mark. Engine
sounds normal.

Head gasket blown? :o(

Vauxhall Astra Merit 1.7 DR L-plate

Thanks in advance.
 
Open wallet surgery coming right up!
head gasket if you are lucky. from description, I would guess a cracked head
as well.
Is it the isuzu ? probably looking at £500+ min. might be cheaper to go an
exchange used motor, rather than piddle about with the head.
Problem is you cant punt it on with those symptoms. forget auction.
Mike
BTW, if you HAVE to run it, i.e to get to work then it sounds like the
damage has already been done. carry lots of water and run with the cap
loose. that might stop the clouds of smoke getting you noticed, if bad.
 
Thanks Mike.
No sure about engine's manufacturer. its 17DR engine naurally aspirated with
EGR system.
it had 103k when i've bought it from the garage (?400) who said it is very
sound engine. its pretty strange its gone just after 900 miles-i've tried my
best to keep it happy :o/
 
dvg said:
Thanks Mike.
No sure about engine's manufacturer. its 17DR engine naurally aspirated with
EGR system.
it had 103k when i've bought it from the garage (?400) who said it is very
sound engine. its pretty strange its gone just after 900 miles-i've tried my
best to keep it happy :o/
Click to expand...
1.7DR? Injector pump at the front of the engine?
That's the Vauxhall lump.
It does sound like a head gasket. Looks like you're taking back to the
garage. I hope you didn't buy it from Yes Car Credit. The cost of repair
+ cambelt + water pump is likely to be about £400 or so.
My ex had one of those engines in an Astra (L reg). Not one of the best
diesels, economical but slow and noisy. When it had done 90K we got rid
of it because it had started to sound very ropey indeed.
Dave
 
Yes it is blown gasket. I've shown it to 3 mechs (whilst looking for a
better quote) and they all confirmed that.
2 Dave: I've bought it from the local garage which have (i hope) no
connection with YCC.
My mech quoted approx £300 for the job but he doesnt know exactly the price
of the parts thus I shoould be prepared to spend more that that sum.

Thanks to all you guys & safe driving.
 
My Astra is a 1.7 DT Vx engine.
Its done 130k and still sounds fine.
I hope i'm not in for a bit of a shock soon !
 
dvg said:
Yes it is blown gasket. I've shown it to 3 mechs (whilst looking for a
better quote) and they all confirmed that.
2 Dave: I've bought it from the local garage which have (i hope) no
connection with YCC.
My mech quoted approx £300 for the job but he doesnt know exactly the price
of the parts thus I shoould be prepared to spend more that that sum.

Thanks to all you guys & safe driving.
Click to expand...

What about the warranty?
Dave
 
dvg said:
Yes it is blown gasket. I've shown it to 3 mechs (whilst looking for a
better quote) and they all confirmed that.
Click to expand...

Dont assume the head is ok. it has to come off anyway, so get it pressure
tested. (who pays is a separate issue. I'll leave advice about that to
others). IMHO you cant tell if its JUST a head gasket without opening it up.

hope for the best, but expect the worse.

Mike
 
2 Dave: I dont think that car was sold with any warranty for that price :o/
 
Mike said:
Dont assume the head is ok. it has to come off anyway, so get it pressure
tested. (who pays is a separate issue. I'll leave advice about that to
others). IMHO you cant tell if its JUST a head gasket without opening it up.

hope for the best, but expect the worse.

Mike
Click to expand...

Out of interest, are these pressure tests performed with a cold head
or do they put hot water prior to pressurising. secondly what pressure
are they pumped to.

--
Regards
Centurion

****************************
Excerise is more than just
shoving a mouse over a mat.
Get out there and do some.
****************************
Flatulence makes the world
smile and clears sinuses.
****************************
 
Well...no one performed any pressure tests whilst trying to diagnose the
fault. One mech tested fan motor and something else electrical, others only
were checking condition of the cooling system (i.e. opening the coolant
reservoir).
Hope its al scheduled in repair procedure.
Thanks
 
dvg said:
Well...no one performed any pressure tests whilst trying to diagnose the
fault. One mech tested fan motor and something else electrical, others
only were checking condition of the cooling system (i.e. opening the
coolant reservoir).
Hope its al scheduled in repair procedure.
Thanks
Click to expand...
All valid, but heres what you do:

starrt engine-if it will start. does it run on all 4 (3,5,8 etc)
if 2 are down then it could be blowing between adjacent cylinders.

remove water cap while still cold(for safety), and bring engine up to at
least 80 deg.
look for bubbling in the water, as combustion gases find their way into the
waterways.
if possible, get a frient to blip the engine while you look at the water, to
look for a sudden burst of bubbles.
You may also find that air will fill some high point then start forcing
water back, with the result that it overflows from the expansion bottle.
you can also look for these last 2 when the engine is hot, do NOT emove the
pressure cap, but stop the engine and listen carefully to the cap, it will
fizz gently if things are blown, as it does its job and releases extra
pressure. might also be weeping water. do not attempt to tighten in the
mistaken belief that this will cure it as these days they are only plastic
and theres a good chance you might break something. If you are the
optimistic type then you can buy a new cap. the only thing this will damage
is your wallet.

also look for water/oil sludge under the oil filler cap.this is pretty much
self explanatory.

I might add that all the above are things that you should check when buying
a car anyhow, as they are simple checks that only take a few minutes.

I dont know the details of pressure teting a head, as thats a specialist
job, but I know it involves cleaning the head, thenlamping it down to a big,
machined flat plate
then pressurizing probably through injector/spark plug holes. Maybe with
air, but a liquid (paraffin?) would make more sense. I too would be
interested to know the details.

Unfortunately, the symptoms of a blown head gasket are also those of a
cracked head. Lets face it, the heads coming off.

Mike
 
Mike said:
All valid, but heres what you do:

starrt engine-if it will start. does it run on all 4 (3,5,8 etc)
if 2 are down then it could be blowing between adjacent cylinders.

remove water cap while still cold(for safety), and bring engine up to at
least 80 deg.
look for bubbling in the water, as combustion gases find their way into the
waterways.
if possible, get a frient to blip the engine while you look at the water, to
look for a sudden burst of bubbles.
You may also find that air will fill some high point then start forcing
water back, with the result that it overflows from the expansion bottle.
you can also look for these last 2 when the engine is hot, do NOT emove the
pressure cap, but stop the engine and listen carefully to the cap, it will
fizz gently if things are blown, as it does its job and releases extra
pressure. might also be weeping water. do not attempt to tighten in the
mistaken belief that this will cure it as these days they are only plastic
and theres a good chance you might break something. If you are the
optimistic type then you can buy a new cap. the only thing this will damage
is your wallet.

also look for water/oil sludge under the oil filler cap.this is pretty much
self explanatory.

I might add that all the above are things that you should check when buying
a car anyhow, as they are simple checks that only take a few minutes.

I dont know the details of pressure teting a head, as thats a specialist
job, but I know it involves cleaning the head, thenlamping it down to a big,
machined flat plate
then pressurizing probably through injector/spark plug holes. Maybe with
air, but a liquid (paraffin?) would make more sense. I too would be
interested to know the details.

Unfortunately, the symptoms of a blown head gasket are also those of a
cracked head. Lets face it, the heads coming off.

Mike
Click to expand...
Thanks Mike,
I was interested because I'm involved in the manufacture of very large
marine diesels and every head is filled with water (off the engine) and
pressurised upto 100psi via the water inlet. Our test rig is nothing
fancy. Just an air supply, 2 shut of valves, a tee piece, an airline
coupling and a gauge.

We blank off the water outlet, fill and pressurize via water inlet.

Even this method isn't 100% accurate as I've know same heads to leak
only when at operating temperature which is little dangerous when you
have water leaking into the cylinder and the engine trying to go
hydraulic (cylinder filling with steam on compression stroke.)

--
Regards
Centurion

****************************
Excerise is more than just
shoving a mouse over a mat.
Get out there and do some.
****************************
Flatulence makes the world
smile and clears sinuses.
****************************
 
Thanks Mike,
I was interested because I'm involved in the manufacture of very large
marine diesels and every head is filled with water (off the engine) and
pressurised upto 100psi via the water inlet. Our test rig is nothing
fancy. Just an air supply, 2 shut of valves, a tee piece, an airline
coupling and a gauge.

We blank off the water outlet, fill and pressurize via water inlet.

Even this method isn't 100% accurate as I've know same heads to leak
only when at operating temperature which is little dangerous when you
have water leaking into the cylinder and the engine trying to go
hydraulic (cylinder filling with steam on compression stroke.)
Click to expand...


You've reminded me that a long time ago I used to work as a fitter in an
engineering company that made (among other things) machinery to make
mattresses. Anyway, cut a long story short, these contraptions were
pneumatic, and we made the recievers for them in house. these had to be
tested (not by me!) and wee done every saturday morning at 10:00 (tea break
time). saturday because there were fewer people in the factory, and tea
break when those few were not around. reason was they too were pressurised
with water, and it wasnt an unknown sight to see one break free and try to
torpedo down the length of the building.!

Apologies to all, this has absolutely nothing to do with the original
thread, just window shopping down memory lane.

Mike

BTW, try here

http://pcwww.liv.ac.uk/~goodhew/Stu...lashversion/OtherServices/PressureTesting.htm

and here

http://www.daverushton.co.uk/pressure.htm

Not exactly definitive, but worth a look
 
Mike said:
You've reminded me that a long time ago I used to work as a fitter in an
engineering company that made (among other things) machinery to make
mattresses. Anyway, cut a long story short, these contraptions were
pneumatic, and we made the recievers for them in house. these had to be
tested (not by me!) and wee done every saturday morning at 10:00 (tea break
time). saturday because there were fewer people in the factory, and tea
break when those few were not around. reason was they too were pressurised
with water, and it wasnt an unknown sight to see one break free and try to
torpedo down the length of the building.!

Apologies to all, this has absolutely nothing to do with the original
thread, just window shopping down memory lane.

Mike

BTW, try here

http://pcwww.liv.ac.uk/~goodhew/Stu...lashversion/OtherServices/PressureTesting.htm

and here

http://www.daverushton.co.uk/pressure.htm

Not exactly definitive, but worth a look
Click to expand...

Very similiar to our set up, although ours being very large
(200 - 500mm dia bores) have one head per cylinder.




--
Regards
Centurion

****************************
Excerise is more than just
shoving a mouse over a mat.
Get out there and do some.
****************************
Flatulence makes the world
smile and clears sinuses.
****************************
 
Mike said:
Ah, large engines.

http://www.bath.ac.uk/~ccsshb/12cyl/

(isnt this fun?)

Mike
Click to expand...

Isn't it a beauty. I seen it before and
often thought.........

Stick some wheels on that baby.
Take it to a tractor pulling contest and say......

'Cop for this suckers'



Sorry chaps for going TOTALLY off topic.
--
Regards
Centurion

****************************
Excerise is more than just
shoving a mouse over a mat.
Get out there and do some.
****************************
Flatulence makes the world
smile and clears sinuses.
****************************
 
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