Omega brakes

  • Thread starter Thread starter Gary Millar
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Gary Millar

My omega still momentarily pulls to the drivers side when lightly applying
the brakes. This has been going on for a while now and even after bleeding
them fitting front new callipers and new hoses its still the same. After the
mot test where the rollers say all is well the mechanic says there is a
definate sensation on a road test of pulling to the right.
The strange thing is that this only happens under light braking.
If you brake hard it stops in a straight line.
If you brake with your hands of the wheel it bakes in a straight line.
If you brake lightly with your hands off the wheel it stops in a straight
line but you can see the steering wheel move momentarily to the left.
But if you brake lightly while holding the wheel you can feel the car
pulling to the right before it brakes in a straight line.
By the wat at the mot the suspension bushes were all passed as OK and the
car was fully 4 wheel aligned 18 month ago and as im the only driver i know
there has been no kerbing etc.
 
In
Gary Millar said:
My omega still momentarily pulls to the drivers side when lightly
applying the brakes. This has been going on for a while now and even
after bleeding them fitting front new callipers and new hoses its
still the same. After the mot test where the rollers say all is well
the mechanic says there is a definate sensation on a road test of
pulling to the right. The strange thing is that this only happens under
light braking.
If you brake hard it stops in a straight line.
If you brake with your hands of the wheel it bakes in a straight line.
If you brake lightly with your hands off the wheel it stops in a
straight line but you can see the steering wheel move momentarily to
the left. But if you brake lightly while holding the wheel you can feel
the car
pulling to the right before it brakes in a straight line.
By the wat at the mot the suspension bushes were all passed as OK and
the car was fully 4 wheel aligned 18 month ago and as im the only
driver i know there has been no kerbing etc.
Click to expand...

Tyre pressures?
Rear brake binding?
tracking?
weak front shocks?

18 months is a long long time after tracking adjustment.


--
Pete M

Mercedes 260E
Ford Capri (ressurection started)
"Never moon a werewolf"

COSOC #5
Scouse Git extraordinaire. Liverpool, Great Britain
 
Not rear brakes as it def pulls at front only
tyre press ok
trackings been checked
shocks just passed mot
I might get all alingnment checked again because i did wonder if there might
be stagger in the front wheel set up
 
have your brakes tested on a brake tested

john

Gary Millar said:
Not rear brakes as it def pulls at front only
tyre press ok
trackings been checked
shocks just passed mot
I might get all alingnment checked again because i did wonder if there
might be stagger in the front wheel set up
Click to expand...
 
Has been done on rolling road and shows up fine this leads me to think that
suspension bushes must be flexing or joints moving but which ones as they
all seem tight and they all passed mot. It costs a fortune to replace them
all !!!
 
Gary Millar said:
My omega still momentarily pulls to the drivers side when lightly applying
the brakes. This has been going on for a while now and even after bleeding
them fitting front new callipers and new hoses its still the same. After the
mot test where the rollers say all is well the mechanic says there is a
definate sensation on a road test of pulling to the right.
The strange thing is that this only happens under light braking.
If you brake hard it stops in a straight line.
If you brake with your hands of the wheel it bakes in a straight line.
If you brake lightly with your hands off the wheel it stops in a straight
line but you can see the steering wheel move momentarily to the left.
But if you brake lightly while holding the wheel you can feel the car
pulling to the right before it brakes in a straight line.
By the wat at the mot the suspension bushes were all passed as OK and the
car was fully 4 wheel aligned 18 month ago and as im the only driver i know
there has been no kerbing etc.
Click to expand...

================
Try swapping the front wheels over. It's possible that you've got a minor
buckle or other fault in one wheel which doesn't show up during tracking.
This is a simple check and if it shows no difference in behaviour at least
it won't cost anything to do.

I would think that if you had a worn bush somewhere in the suspension /
steering it would be more likely to produce an effect during heavy rather
than light breaking.

Although you said that the effect is felt at the front it's still possible
that there's a slight imbalance in the rear brakes. I recently fitted new
rear linings to my car (self adjusting brakes) and there was a very definite
sideways pull felt at the steering until the self adjusting mechanism sorted
itself out. Try checking your rear brake adjustment with both wheels off the
ground together and adjust if necessary. If they're self-adjusting try
re-setting the self adjusters to give them a fresh start. One of them may be
siezed.

Cic.
 
I could try changing the front wheels round although the tyres are
directional and mat cause a different sensation
 
Gary Millar said:
I could try changing the front wheels round although the tyres are
directional and mat cause a different sensation
Click to expand...


<snipped>
===============
A temporary swap would still be worth a try to see if it shows up any fault.
A few short stop / start tests would show up any discrepancy (if any) and
you can immediately change back to ensure that your tyres are safe. You
might also do the same with the rear wheels to see if anything changes. It's
a process of trial and error really - tedious and frustrating but worthwhile
when you find the solution.

Cic.
 
Yep trial and error as you say i'll try some more next weekend but ant
advice from any one would be usefull
 
Gary Millar said:
I could try changing the front wheels round although the tyres are
directional and mat cause a different sensation
Click to expand...


Try changing front to back then
 
Is this light pullingonly first thing in the morning (or when the car is
cold if you happen to work nights...)?

Although tricky to do, and requiring both luck and skill, from a cold start
try to drive 2-3 miles without much using the brakes, GENTLY pull over and
then carefully feel the wheels to see if one feels noticeably warmer than
the other. (but not necessarily hot). next, run up to speed-30mph is ok-then
gently brake almost to a stop. Take your foot off the pedal and let the car
come to rest naturally on level ground. does the car stop smoothly, or does
it give a (very) minor lurch as it comes to a stop?

Based on other postings in this thread, my gut feeling would be you have a
brake caliper sticking ever so slightly. it doesnt pull under heavy braking
so I dont think its a bad problem. Although front or back binding can cause
pulling, IMHO for rear brakes to bind bad enough to start pulling, you would
start noticing bad smells from the car. If you dont know the smell of
burning brakes, then good for you! Although you never forget the smell, its
not on the list of 50 things to do/smell before you die. I dont know what
kind of calipers you have there, but it was the bane of my life on many old
bikes of mine with a floating caliper front brakes, where you only have a
piston on one side and it pulls the back side of the caliper against the
disc. Kinda like a 'G' clamp. only unlike drum brakes there isnt actually
any force available to retract the caliper. sure, the withdrawal of the
master cylender piston when you take your foot of the pedal will (should!)
marginally withdraw the slave pistons at all 4 wheels, but if one is
sticking just slightly then it will tend to withdraw the other three just
that little bit more. Also, the caliper might not be floating free from the
back end, with the same results. If you dont have a floating caliper, ie you
have pistons pushing the pads on both sides of the disc then I would look to
see if a pad is stuck in slight contact with the disc. simply remove (Are
you reading this Mr Haynes? I once had a good laugh when I read that in one
of your books!) the pads, clean the edges up in an appropriate manner untill
they are smooth and clean and also the corresponding area of the caliper, so
the pads move smoothly. replace with just a lick of grease on the metal
edges of the pad (for chrissakes make sure you use the proper high melting
point stuff for the job, not the first pot that comes to hand) then put back
together and road test. before you do, remember that brake dust can be
dangerous to your health, so dont go sniffing it and dont forget to tighten
ALL your wheelnuts.

Sorry for going on at some length, especially if this is all old stuff to
you, but remember that other people read these posts and (hopefully) learn
from them.

Cheers

Mike

BTW, forgot to add that if you have one pad noticeably thinner than the rest
then odds are thats the culprit. if the problem turns out to be a sticking
piston then you might have to spend some wonga. But get back to us first.
 
Mike said:
Is this light pullingonly first thing in the morning (or when the car is
cold if you happen to work nights...)?

Although tricky to do, and requiring both luck and skill, from a cold start
try to drive 2-3 miles without much using the brakes, GENTLY pull over and
then carefully feel the wheels to see if one feels noticeably warmer than
the other. (but not necessarily hot). next, run up to speed-30mph is ok-then
gently brake almost to a stop. Take your foot off the pedal and let the car
come to rest naturally on level ground. does the car stop smoothly, or does
it give a (very) minor lurch as it comes to a stop?

Based on other postings in this thread, my gut feeling would be you have a
brake caliper sticking ever so slightly. it doesnt pull under heavy braking
so I dont think its a bad problem. Although front or back binding can cause
pulling, IMHO for rear brakes to bind bad enough to start pulling, you would
start noticing bad smells from the car. If you dont know the smell of
burning brakes, then good for you! Although you never forget the smell, its
not on the list of 50 things to do/smell before you die. I dont know what
kind of calipers you have there, but it was the bane of my life on many old
bikes of mine with a floating caliper front brakes, where you only have a
piston on one side and it pulls the back side of the caliper against the
disc. Kinda like a 'G' clamp. only unlike drum brakes there isnt actually
any force available to retract the caliper. sure, the withdrawal of the
master cylender piston when you take your foot of the pedal will (should!)
marginally withdraw the slave pistons at all 4 wheels, but if one is
sticking just slightly then it will tend to withdraw the other three just
that little bit more. Also, the caliper might not be floating free from the
back end, with the same results. If you dont have a floating caliper, ie you
have pistons pushing the pads on both sides of the disc then I would look to
see if a pad is stuck in slight contact with the disc. simply remove (Are
you reading this Mr Haynes? I once had a good laugh when I read that in one
of your books!) the pads, clean the edges up in an appropriate manner untill
they are smooth and clean and also the corresponding area of the caliper, so
the pads move smoothly. replace with just a lick of grease on the metal
edges of the pad (for chrissakes make sure you use the proper high melting
point stuff for the job, not the first pot that comes to hand) then put back
together and road test. before you do, remember that brake dust can be
dangerous to your health, so dont go sniffing it and dont forget to tighten
ALL your wheelnuts.

Sorry for going on at some length, especially if this is all old stuff to
you, but remember that other people read these posts and (hopefully) learn
from them.

Cheers

Mike

BTW, forgot to add that if you have one pad noticeably thinner than the rest
then odds are thats the culprit. if the problem turns out to be a sticking
piston then you might have to spend some wonga. But get back to us first.
Click to expand...
===============
One minor amendment to the above suggestions from 'Mike'. The rear brake
need not be 'binding' to cause a pull. One rear brake may be adjusted very
slightly more closely than the other but still not in permanent contact with
the drum. In this case one brake would 'bite' slightly before the other thus
producing a pull which would be felt under gentle braking but would probably
be masked under heavier braking.

Cic.
 
Cicero said:
===============
One minor amendment to the above suggestions from 'Mike'. The rear brake
need not be 'binding' to cause a pull. One rear brake may be adjusted
very
slightly more closely than the other but still not in permanent contact
with
the drum. In this case one brake would 'bite' slightly before the other
thus
producing a pull which would be felt under gentle braking but would
probably
be masked under heavier braking.

Cic.
Click to expand...
Good point, And I agree completely, but rears dragging have to be a lot
worse than fronts to produce noticeable effects. Do omegas have rear drums?
By comparison the rear brake/handbrake on my old vectra looks like it was
dreamed up by the apprentice on a monday morning just after a trip to the
lav with a copy of last weeks sport. Dunno what he was thinking about, but
its a right **** of a design.

Mike
 
Thanks for all the info lads and it all makes sense and has been done before
i posted this. Ive found a guy on the cavweb forum who has posted a problem
almost exactly to the letter the same as this one matbe he can help>if i
find the problem i'll let you all know
 
In
Gary Millar said:
Thanks for all the info lads and it all makes sense and has been done
before i posted this. Ive found a guy on the cavweb forum who has
posted a problem almost exactly to the letter the same as this one
matbe he can help>if i find the problem i'll let you all know
Click to expand...

No probs, but learn to snip, and don't top post ;-)


--
Pete M

Mercedes 260E
Ford Capri (ressurection started)
"Never moon a werewolf"

COSOC #5
Scouse Git extraordinaire. Liverpool, Great Britain
 
Mike said:
news:[email protected]...
Click to expand...
Good point, And I agree completely, but rears dragging have to be a
lot worse than fronts to produce noticeable effects. Do omegas have
rear drums? By comparison the rear brake/handbrake on my old vectra
looks like it was dreamed up by the apprentice on a monday morning
just after a trip to the lav with a copy of last weeks sport. Dunno
what he was thinking about, but its a right **** of a design.

Mike
Click to expand...

They have both rear drums and rear discs, best of both worlds :-) The drum
bit is handbrake only. I can only assume the reason is to stop the Citroen
problem of when the discs cool down the car rolls away and crashes (for
those people who don't bother to keep the car in gear or P when
stationary!). I've had a seized piston on a rear disc which caused the other
sides pad to wear down very quickly indeed!

Will
 
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